turbos again!

[nickvr 0]

my point exactly dude! anyway what about injectors? any point of upgrading these ive read in a magazine bentley cont gt injestor will work with this engine are they gonna flow to much fuel tho?

[Russ_vr6 12]

really? would have thought they be bit big?

[nickvr 0]

in a vw mag its a rather extreme engine but thats what it running

[IbiVR 0]

They wont be too big. well not in terms of flow.

For a VRT at 1 bar - 400bhp ish, you'll be wanting 440cc injectors (green tops).

Continental T is a V8 with, what - 450hp? so you have 30% more fuel and similar power. ie 440's on a v8 are good for 600hp.

Not sure what injectors they use, so weather they will physically fit etc.

Tom.

[Russ_vr6 12]

true ate i get lost in flow and too much tech talk lol

[jims13 6]

i always used the rule of thumb, never run the injectors at more than 80% of their max duty cycle. when i had me turbo motors it served me well. 440's should are good for upto 270-280 on a 4 pot motor, above that they are stretched.

hth, and my 2 pence

jim

[nickvr 0]

continental gt is a 12 cylinder w12 not v8 dude, anyone got any idea of the flow rate? i think there black in colour!?

[IbiVR 0]

Ah GT, I was thinking T. Well 12 cylinders at 550 bhp. 440's would be good for 800 odd HP on a 12cyl.

Either way, there not too big.

Yep defo re. 80% duty. Fueling becomes innacurate after that because of the slew rate of the solonoid.

Tom.

[FishWick 21]

Works fine for me running the stock injectors at 100% duty.

[IbiVR 0]

eek.

Tom.

[jims13 6]

kev, im not saying dont run them at 100% but if you do . chances are something nasty will happen sooner rather than later...do the 440's from a skyline fit ? r32 ones should be cheap, think i used to pay 60quid for a set of six.. just a idea, should be good for another few brake (fuelling wise)

[FishWick 21]

LOL! Don't worry, it's only a temporary measure :-)

At the moment I'm 4" MAF with stock software and stock injectors + BEGI FMU and I tell you what, she pulls fantastic. 100% duty is indeed iffy sounding, but in reality it's just the pintle fully open and the BEGI blasting fuel through at 100psi..... it's not as bad as it sounds and is good for up to 20psi of boost, just not very economical, LOL!, but fuel on the fat side is safe ;-) In fact, if I didn't give a toss about economy, I'd leave it that way as it's really smooth and torquey, but I want more control over the tune, hence the DTA P8Pro and 42lb Genesis injectors.

I looked at all the injector options - Bosch Greens, Lucas, Siemens Deka 7, Rochester etc etc but the Genesis came out tops for atomisation performance.

[Earwig 89]

Sounds to me like Turbo is becoming a much more affordable option ?

From what I thought nobody ever went turbo as it always cost twice the price of a Supercharger.

I have always thought about Supercharging and was hoping to do it sometime next year but now threads like this are making me sway a little more towards the turbo.

Only thing that worries me is I have no real clue about it all. I read these threads and bits of it start to sink in peice by piece but there is just so much to take into account.

Good thing with a supercharger is you tend to buy a package that bolts on. :-)

With a Turbo you tend to have to build the thing yourself and source all the parts and brackets and this is where I start to think about going back to a charger..... :-(

I think I would prefer a Turbo though !

Mark.

[jims13 6]

mark , with the turbo , the only thing you would need to make yourslef or source as such , is the downpipe, but any decent welder can do that for you, the rest is of the shelf stuff, depenfing on what power you want, its encouraging to see that the vr will run a turbo on stock ecu and injectors...has anyone thought about megasquirt for the ecu..200 quid to buy built and it all open source, and does everythingn you need plus as you get to map it you learn as you go. loads of base maps avalible on the forums.

i myself am also leaning towards turbocharging, maybe a kit will appear for the masses circa - 300bhp.

[Earwig 89]

Well if I did it I would also be looking for around the 300 mark...

Once you get past that I think it will be difficult to put it all down....

Wonder what a group buy on something like all this could work out at ?

:-)

Mark.

[nickvr 0]

group buy - brilliant idea!!

[jims13 6]

what have i started

[nickvr 0]

something spectacular my friend lol!! think maybe later on in the year if theres enough interest we could get some prices together!?

[Earwig 89]

Well hopefully I can scrape the money together some time this year. If there are enough of us and the prices turn out to be very good it would be silly not to....

Mark.,

[jims13 6]

yeah maybe speak to ibvr, i here he knows where to get all the good stuff from.

[FishWick 21]

its encouraging to see that the vr will run a turbo on stock ecu and injectors...

It runs fine' date=' but as it's using the brute force method (loads of pressure through small injectors), it runs very fat, which means economy is terrible, LOL!

Long term though, I'd recommend larger injectors which you can meter more efficiently with a decent remap and therefore get reasonable economy on boost. But boost dependant regulators and stock ECU and injectors does work.

has anyone thought about megasquirt for the ecu..200 quid to buy built and it all open source, and does everythingn you need plus as you get to map it you learn as you go. loads of base maps avalible on the forums.

There's a guy on the Corrado forum that's built a squirt and running it on his VR6. Normally aspirated first to test it and now he's doing the turbo install. What he did say was that even on N/A, the engine felt perkier low down and a heck of a lot smoother with no flatspots, so it's encouraging.

Plenty of other standalone options too, but the squirt has to be the best value for money.

i myself am also leaning towards turbocharging' date=' maybe a kit will appear for the masses circa - 300bhp.

[/quote']

That's a good target figure to start with. 8-9psi will get you close to 300hp with a GT turbo, or an older T3/T4.

Trouble is though, a couple of weeks after you've become accustomed to it, you'll want and even harder punch when you press the gas, so you'll end up winding up the boost :-)

Best to build the engine for 450-500, but run it at 300. That way you'll have plenty of scope for tuning and running it at low boost means better economy, less stress on the gearbox and the stock clutch can hang onto 8psi OK too.

If you have an external wastegate, it'll be open quite frequently compared to higher boost, which can introduce some extra exhaust noise, depending on make of wastegate and how you dump the gas.

There are a number of kits due out soon from various tuning houses with varying prices according to spec.

[jims13 6]

ah thank for that. makes alot of sense, and i'll start looking into things. les see what i can come up with.

[IbiVR 0]

Our software will be ready soon. Plug and play OBD1 and OBD2 versions for up to 1 bar boost. We have a few cars running it at the moment but its not quite 100% ready for general release...

Re parts - I'll help out where i can. I would be able to lower the price on the RHD manifolds for a group buy.

I dont have many left at the mo but can get some more in easy enough if needed.

Same goes for spacers.

Anythign i can help out with ask away.

Tom.

[Earwig 89]

What do you mean by a RHD Manifold ?

My car is RHD so will surely have a RHD manifold ?

I would maybe like to try and get a group buy going sometime this year for Turbo kits..... Will be good if kits become available for the VR with everything included :-)

Do you think the price of a Full Turbo set up is going to be as cheap or cheaper than a S/C kit ? Or is it still going to be more expensive ? Turbo has always been let down by it's steep price but seems it's the right way to go if we can afford it as there is alot more scope to play, whereas S/C you are pretty much stuck within the regoin of the kit you have......

Mark.

[IbiVR 0]

If your cars is RHD then you will need a turbo manifold that will fit a RHD car.

At the moment there isnt really any RHD fitment turbo kits on the market. ATP/Kinetic etc will not fit.

There is the ebay one which i can get you for £1650, but its really not that good, and its low boost. youd need to add a fair bit to it to get any real power out of it.

Best bet is to make yourself up a custom kit. its tailored to what you want and will get you more bhp at the end.

A good turbo kit will be more than a SC kit, but then with the right parts you'll get more out of it. If your only after 6psi odd - 270-300bhp then SC is more cost effective.

Tom.