M4VTY 0 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 Hi There I'm new to VR6 owners club so hello everyone, last thing I thought about was asking for help on my first day in here.I took my VR6 to a VW dealership on Thursday to have a new ABS cable fitted as it was corroded right back to the control unit, they have fixed this and also changed the temp sensor then they call me at 16:00 today and say we can't start your car, it's something to do with the Clifford Concept 300 alarm system, despite them having my car running all day, I go down there to try and immobilse the car with the key fob remote and fiddle with the buttons on the remote and sure enough the car is de-immobilised, the negine turns over but it will not fire.They told me that the engine just died whilst running which I do not believe, they also said that they were going to charge me to find and fix the fault where I told them where to go.The VAG-COM is showing that they cant find the ECU it's not being picked up on their computer showing not present, they have also checked the relays.Can anyone help me here, they have not got a clue abou this problemor what it might be, I called clifford alarms they said it cant be the alarm beause thats working apparently as we went through the process over the phone. Link to post Share on other sites
mike 6 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 blimey mate, i wouldnt pay and threaten them with legal action see where that gets you...sounds like they have cocked up somewhere. Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 I read their terms and condions says that under the 1977 the dealer will not be liable for loss or damage to the vehicle whilst in their possesion whatosever whilst in their workshop, wish i had left the bloody abs light on with a fault on the nearside sensor.according to VAG-COM they are not detecting my ECU, which I saw for myself they said the car just cut out.do you think that they may have f****d my ECU? Link to post Share on other sites
mike 6 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 its possible yea..iv just had a new ecu...well a s/hand one 150 fitted @ mid vw Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 I going to try and get hold of a S/hand ECU tomorrow from somewhere to give to VW to try. can they be fitted easily i.e just unbolt it then just plug it in? Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 did you have problems with starting the car before you replaced your ECU? Link to post Share on other sites
mike 6 Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 no not at all mate, was down on power and giving ot false codes wich is why they did mine. Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 VW seem to think mine is somthing to do with the clifford alam delspite being able to immobilise the car, going there with a cliffnet kit tomorrow to see what that shows, still does not explain why VAG-COM cant pick up the ECU, will post a reply so everyone can see what killed my beast. Link to post Share on other sites
adam_christie 0 Posted September 15, 2007 Report Share Posted September 15, 2007 TBH mate it sounds like they may have done some damage, be it work-wise or more than likely "tinkering" wise that has screwed your alarm system. ECU's don't just die unless there's been a major electrical current through the vehicle, or severe mis-wiring, which there shouldn't have been if they were just changing the ABS lead and a temp sensor (By the way, what temp sensor did they replace? Some temp sensors should last 200K miles and more. Did they tell you that a temp sensor needed replacing in the first place? If not, you may have a good case,) Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 15, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2007 Yes the told me the idleing problem would be a temp sensor £128 to replace the part £129 to clean the throttle body, none of which they have done yetI went down there this morning, only service staff were there, ECU is still dead! and it has nothing to do with the alarm.Also notice that instad of actually replacing the whole abs cable right back to the ABS module, they have just chopped the wire in the engine and joined it then wrapped it with tape, I could have done that myslef £92 for that!!!Wait till I speak to the Service Manager on Monday Link to post Share on other sites
rodney 17 Posted September 15, 2007 Report Share Posted September 15, 2007 You can use that as a sub standard work (Not fit for purpose) and ask them to complete it to the expected level. You can report them to VW and use VW headoffice complaint procedure. VW may help you especiallly as you are a member of an owners club and have "a wide circle of friends". The stealer must inform you of the escallation process (ISO9000). Don't turn up in ripped jeans etc...Did you sign anything to say you agreed to their terms and conditions??? If not send a letter saying you are only prepared to accept the job done under your personal tems and conditions. (contract law) and keep a copy of it. Record the conversations and make notes in the meeting and ask them to sign the notes ! They do have a duty of care! which means they must take all reasonable steps..... If the car fails whilst in their possession you can say they have not taken reasonable steps &/or you can question their quality of workmanship and ask to see all the training records for the individuals that are working on your car. (They are required to produce them in line with their ISO9000 procedures) If they do not have relevant certificates again they do not have a leg to stand on. The longer it is their workshop the longer they have issues with other peoples cars because you are taking up work space. Failing that have curry on Sunday nite. go in first thing in the morning and ask to see the managemet team in their office. If they fail to offer anything. curl one off in his shoes and say you'll be back tommorrow until they fix it... LOLAs long as you are firm and polite they have to make an offer even if it is to take your car elsewhere... Don't get angry just don't give in. you have a spare set of keys so can take your property at any time. If they say no just remind them of their own terms at the begining. Then they can persue you through the courts and you can fix it yourself, which will cost them more than the job, which is always a good thing to remind them as they are approaching the end of Q3 financial reporting and want every penny.I have been through it and deal in contract law for a living I ended up calling them on the hour every hour for 2 days and popped in for my breakfast Lunch and dinner. I was very Polite and eventually they did it to get rid of me, as I was slowing the whole process up whilst other customers had to wait and heard what I had to say in a firm polite voice just loud enough for everyone to look whilst they were deciding what to buy new They dropped a Gas bottle on the wing and it wasn't their fault. They did a very good job as well on the fix People always want the easy option/life. Make the easy option a fix rather than having to deal with you in the nicest possible way!Good luck we'll be listening Link to post Share on other sites
rodney 17 Posted September 15, 2007 Report Share Posted September 15, 2007 Assuming it's not your alarm of course Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2007 Thanks very much I really apprecite that, I will post how it goes, at the moment theyre not saying they won't fix it, some idiot half my age is tring to tell me I'm going to pay for it, I alread have a clifford alamr fitter onstandby ready to go and tell them it's not the alarm Link to post Share on other sites
vr6newcomer 1 Posted September 16, 2007 Report Share Posted September 16, 2007 I think you need to stop paying these charges after you get this affair sorted and either start working on your car yourself or go to a specialist. Link to post Share on other sites
Steve @ 1 Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Yes the told me the idleing problem would be a temp sensor £128 to replace the part £129 to clean the throttle body' date=' none of which they have done yet[/quote']OMG!!!! £129?? Throttle body remove and clean 30mins max + can of carb cleaner. And as for the temp sensor .....!!!! Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Hi everyoneday 5 without my VR6, and i'm starting to get very hacked off, I wote a very long e-mail to the service manager on sunday. To which they called today AM, I think all of my points have been noted, theysay that an auto electrician will be coming out to the dealership tomorrow!I mentioned the ABS cable being cut and joined under the bonnet by cutting the wire and joining it then taping it up, I was told apparently that it how the part comes from the dealership and they do not wire them directly into the ABS module so be aware this is something that can be done quite easily.Have just called the dealership and they advised that the auto electrician has fixed the problem and the car now starts, apparently it's a fuse that keeps blowing, never has it happened since the 2 years that I have had the car!!! the service manager is waiting for a report from the egineer to confirm exactkly what fuse keeps blowing. I'm very interested myself, I'm told that I will get a call back at 10-11 tomorrow.This has been a really shit situation to be in, I will post the details tomorrow so that everyone who ever has a problem like this can review it.Also how and what should you do to clean a throttle body? I will pay the money on this occasion as I just want my VR6 back in working order. Link to post Share on other sites
Steve @ 1 Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Also how and what should you do to clean a throttle body? I will pay the money on this occasion as I just want my VR6 back in working order.Its held on by 4 6mm allen bolts. Plus you need to remove a couple of hoses and the throttle cable etc. Takes about 10mins to remove. Once the body is off simply clean the throttle out with some cleaning fluids and a rag. Really is very simple and should cost no more that 1/2 - 3/4 hour labour at most. £129 is quite frankly a massive rip off chap. I would go else where and save a load of green. Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Cheers Steve, If the VW dealership have not already done it by the time I get a call tomorrow I'll collect the car and do it myself. Link to post Share on other sites
Steve @ 1 Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 Cool if you need some help / pics just give us a shout Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 much appreciated, I will always have a go at doing something when I know how Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 Well I just picked up my VR6, the VW dealership opted not to do my throttle body clean, as now the car is running they refuse to touch it anymore, they have not charged me for the call out of an auto electrician either, they did tell me that the cause of the car not starting was that fuse 14 or 15 which I am not sure what theses fuses are for was blown.Thanks RCF for you help with the legalities etc, and the calling every hour and only delaing with the service manager really helps.If anybody has any pics on how to clean the throttle body this would be really helpfull my VR is an OBD2, the throttle body seems to be held on by 6 star fitment bolts. Link to post Share on other sites
SiGainey 1 Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 It's really simple m8 - even I can do it If you look at this http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VR6-OBD1-MK3-GOLF-PORT-POLISHED-THROTTLE-BODY-74MM_W0QQitemZ200152927640QQihZ010QQcategoryZ72205QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem you can see the two bolt holes on the first picture and two of the others on the other picture - it's a 5 o 6mm allen key and they are pretty invisible, but just undo them and the throttle body if off (once you remove the big inlet pipe) Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 I can clean it before the butterfly and take of the burring with a stanley knife, is that all that should be done or should or should I open the butterfly and clean as far as I can get, Link to post Share on other sites
Steve @ 1 Posted September 19, 2007 Report Share Posted September 19, 2007 If you dont want to remove the body completely just open the throttle and clean as far as you can. Link to post Share on other sites
M4VTY 0 Posted September 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2007 Here's somthing you need to watch out for, yesterday I collected my car from the VW dealership, they said ABS light had been done etc......They tell me to wait ouside the front while they bring the car round, 15 minutes goes by and the guy brings it to me running ABS light is out great thought no more of it an went home.Later it struck me that I had not started the car since collecting it, so went outside started the car and the ABS light was on again.Figure this the way I do, was waiting for the car for 15 minutes they started it and realised the ABS light was still on so they think that are we going to do the light is still on, they hook the car upto VAG-COM and turn the ABS light of then give me the car back running giving me no reason to turn the car off, I can't prove it but it's very credible!!!!!So what it went in for was never fixed..... I give up f****k the ABS light it can stay on Link to post Share on other sites
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