The 3.2 sump on a VR6 thread

[PhatVR6 0]

As promised, I had a look at fitting the Audi 3.2 sump on the VR.

I've heard of people fitting the R32 sump, but that's pointless, as the mk4 R32 sump is the same as the 4motion one, and literally just an alloy version of the VR6 one.

The audi 3.2 one however (and the mk5 R32 I guess, don't know for sure) is shallower, and baffled from the factory.

Here goes.

Firstly, bear in mind this is a damaged sump. The plank who removed the engine from the A3 just dropped it, and smashed the sump to bits...cheers for that...

Here's the plastic baffle. well, half of it, the other bit was smashed off. It's normally bolted in.

sat next to the VR sump

Early VR6 rubber gasket laid over it just to show the bolt pattern is identical.

You don't actually need a gasket as it's a machined surface, so just use a sealant.

VR depth on the back corner

compared to the 3.2 sump (allow an extra 5mm as this one is flattened)

and at the plug

I offered it up to the engine, but as I feared, the vr6 oil pump is too long, so you need the 3.2 one (which is the same, but has a shorter pickup.

note how the capacity is retained with this section at the back

part numbers and prices to follow.

Mod Edit To Upload Pics

[craggsy 91]

Top marks that man, cheers Paul it might stop people moaning that it'll get damaged easier but if its smaller it will help. When prices and part numbers get posted i'll make this a sticky for people.

[Lizard Racing 0]

I looked into this last year. Sump alone was £180ish!

[thegoth 5]

Excellent work. I've upload the photos so they work in Lightbox. Hope I've got them back in the right order.

[craggsy 91]

But they will be readily available tho Alex....where as the mk3 will be getting harder and harder to get

[Lizard Racing 0]

True, but I saw little advantage at the time and spent the money else where . However anyone contemplating oil pump renewal or rebuild should consider this for sure.

[Radostormvr6 2]

This looks good, very interested how you get on

[Phat VR6 3]

This is great, I fcuked my standard sump up on speed bumps and was looking for a shallow sump..Didn't have any luck but now its found me lol Doing a engine rebuild aswell so would be nice to changed the oil pump but im sure there over £200.

Thanks real phat VR6 lol

[philbatesvr6 0]

thing is though lookin at the pics does that mean that the bottom half of bell housing bolts dont line up ?

[craggsy 91]

Looks that way. But if Paul says it will be fine id be inclined to go with what he says as he know the VR engines inside out

[PhatVR6 0]

The bell housing and sump don't need to "line up", the stock VR sump doesn't bolt to the bellhousing, just that flimsy tin clutch cover bolts to it. You no longer need that cover, as the sump covers it.

[philbatesvr6 0]

ah i get ya,

[antonio_b12 1]

very useful, good work

[FishWick 21]

Smart.

FWIW, the Golf R32 sump is exactly like the baffled one in first pic cause I bought one from VW and gave it to Stealth to fit whilst putting my 3.0 block in. They tried to fit it but the oil pump fouled as mentioned.

We weren't sure at the time if the R32 pump would bolt straight in, but we do now, so that's cool.

I'll be trying the R32 / Audi sump again in the summer when cornering speeds are higher!

[FishWick 21]

Audi 3.2 V6 sump - 021103603Q - £80.87 inc VAT

Audi 3.2 V6 oil pump - 021115105B - £90.48 inc VAT.

Double check the prices with your own dealer because they are prices I got from an Audi dealer who gives me discount ;-)

[FishWick 21]

Oh and you also need the R32 or Audi dipstick tube and dipstick. It bolts onto the oil filter housing rather than the intake manifold. Handy if you have a short runner or non standard intake etc.

[FishWick 21]

OK, went to pick up my sump and pump and they're wrong. We looked on the Audi ETKA and can't find a baffled sump for any 3.2 Audi.

It is definitely the R32 that has the baffled sump

These are therefore the revised part numbers and everything you need:-

R32 baffled sump - 022 103 601R - £89

R32 oil pump - 022 115 105E - £103

R32 oil pipe - 021 115 203 - ~ £20

Sump sealant - D176 404 A2 - ~£15

The oil pipe connects to the block and is different to the Audi and 12V pipes.

Normal silicon sealant doesn't long in hot oil, so I'd recommend the white stuff VAG use (listed above).

[FishWick 21]

£214 for the whole project.

Installed the pump last night. The R32 pump appears to be identical to the 12V pump, except the pick up head, which is shorter as Paul mentioned. You could in theory bolt an R32 pick up head to your 12V pump, but VW don't sell it seperately.

The R32 output pipe is also the same as the 12V's, but has a captive O ring at the block end, which the 12V doesn't, so VW obviously addressed a slight issue there. The pump end of the pipe just dry joints to the pump flange like the 12V.

I'll throw on the sump tonight and let you know what I think. Mind you, I don't suppose I'll know if it works unless I go round a 90 degree bend at 500mph and the oil light doens't come on :-)

[ChrisP 0]

It does beg the question of why you have gone to the effort and expense of fitting those bits then Kev?

[FishWick 21]

This thread isn't for justifying my motives for doing it, but if you must know:-

1) I enjoy working on the car and trying new parts. It's just a hobby.

2) Because I had to change the pump anyway, and thought I may aswell try the newer stuff whilst I was down there as it's barely any more money than the old 12V stuff.

3) Because you said it yourself, with all the time and money invested in my engine, it makes sense to protect the crank from running dry, despite the fact I'm unlikely to ever track it.

Yes I initally questioned the need for it, but I'm entitled to change my mind and the parts were cheaper than I thought once I looked into it.

[ChrisP 0]

Sorry Kev, I wasnt asking for the aim of getting you to justify everything you do, more of it isnt something that would normally be done just because it can be, purely because it isnt cheap - if you needed to change the pump and you wanted to go that route, then fair enough

[FishWick 21]

No worries.

I agree it's not cheap, but I've always been one to experiment with new stuff..... even if just for the shear hell of it :-)

Well it's all in and running.

The only mod I had to make was to cut a small section out of the plastic baffle where the dipstick passes through because the R32's dipstick sits 1.5" closer to the gearbox than the 12V's. Strange.

They probably moved it for intake manifiold clearance reasons?

Anyway, the R32 dipstick and guide tube are different too, due to the sump being a different shape, but the capacity is still 6 litres.

The pump is a little whiney when cold, but no more so than the 12V, just a slightly deeper tone. I suspect it's largely because the R32 runs 5/30 Castrol SLX and I use 10W/60 Castrol edge, so it's a little thick. It's silent when hot though and the pressures are within spec.

I gave the car absolute death round some very hard turns over the weekend, so much so I almost fell out of my seat (that's another upgrade I need to do) and the oil pressure gauge didn't flicker at all. So I guess it works, LOL!

Another bonus is the R32 sump sits above the subframe level (i.e. above the front wishbone bush mounts), so it won't get taken out over speed humps..... the subframe will take the brunt instead, but that's cheaper than a new engine.

[anto 0]

This is excellent news. I'm just about to send in my order to VW.

We just need all the R32 parts listed by Kev plus the R32 dipstick tube and dipstick. Is that right?

[craggsy 91]

This is excellent news. I'm just about to send in my order to VW.

We just need all the R32 parts listed by Kev plus the R32 dipstick tube and dipstick. Is that right?

Thats the way it reads mate

[FishWick 21]

Sorry chaps, forgot to mention......scrap the R32 dipstick and guide tube, they're not much use on the 12V.

Instead you need the 24V 4 motion guide tube and dipstick.