Turbo the VR6 or just buy an EVO?

[DanH 1]

if i had evo money to spend......i'd go e39 m5.....400bhp through the real wheels and all the car you'll ever need.....

[Phat VR6 3]

don't get me wrong. im sure that a properly set up VRT would be a proper weapon on track and street.. problem is ive been brain washed into splits, stretched tyres and always loved my car low.. when ever i hit bumpy country roads with loads of tight corners every 40m, jumps, gravel mud ect (the roads i love) and my wheels start rubbing there always a part of me that can't help thinking that a evo would be so much more fun to drive

[jims13 6]

yeah it would be , but running cost arnt what people would have you believe.. insurance is dear, and they do break, quite often. you also need to spend big money to get big power.. can you get 450 whp, from a stock engine bar , spacer plate and injectors ? in a evo..

ive been out in loadsof evo's and they are great , corner like nothing else, but 70% is the electronics . skylines are much the same, expensive to buy and also expensive to tune, its bull if your told otherwise, to get a big power liner, you need forged this and forged that. scooby's well, lets just say choclate pistons.. much mmore than 350 bhp an you need forged internals. now granted the 4wd jap brigade all look nice, sounds good and go well, but they are not daily cars that can be driven in a real world.

ive owned 4 200 sx's before they were drifted to death , and athough nice cars , big power is yet again a very expensive hobby.

ok, so a charged vr6 may cost you a bit, but if you have the base car then , a dream of a good handling, powerfull a-b car isnt that far off

[golfrabbit33 0]

vee aaarr teee.

[gavinvr6 0]

for me it would have to be the vrt. i do love a big power liner or evo but i know they break very easily, although i think everyone will agree a vr6 isnt the most reliable engine and lots of silly little things can go wrong and often do BUT the way it delivers it's power and the way it relentlessly pull's to the red line without a 2nd thought, even on an old dog tired or half broken engine. and that is only amplified in an fi vr6. so if you love your vr you'll get a renewed love like the first time you drove one when it's got a tubby strapped on it.

[Phat VR6 3]

tempting though isn't it lol. i was looking at the old scoobys . £1500 4 wheel drive 270bhp, then rip all the interior out of it, just to hammer it around like. so i don't have to beat on the VR. As jim says i was shocked at the price to get them over 350 bhp.. for a 400+bhp set up it was somewhere around 10k

[golfrabbit33 0]

i had two scooby`s, both for a very short time, same as you thought Tom, cheap 4wd...........

but i was so un nerved by the sound of the doors closing that i sold the first one as it scared me to death with the thought of milk bottle lid doors on a car that i got to drive like a **** folding in and offering me NO protection. for some stupid reason i got another bout 5 months after, thinking the estate wouldnt be so bad, but same thing, if you hit anything sideways in a scoob you WILL get hurt

if they where solid like vw`s then i would have kept it, but every time i shut the door,i instantly thought, if i hit something my side im DEAD! i never felt safe enough to give it the beans!

the reason for comming back to dubland was subaru`s unsafe build quality.

[jimmyb 2]

theres only 1 4x4 turbo i would have. the brutal lancia delta integrale,

[b road blaster 0]

tempting though isn't it lol. i was looking at the old scoobys . £1500 4 wheel drive 270bhp' date=' then rip all the interior out of it, just to hammer it around like. so i don't have to beat on the VR. As jim says i was shocked at the price to get them over 350 bhp.. for a 400+bhp set up it was somewhere around 10k

[/quote']

for 1500 quid its gonna be a wrx(246 bhp) or a uk (215 bhp) not a sti which is the 280 one also gonna a bag of nails mate as jim has said anything over 350 is gonna cost a shed load to do and 350 really is the limit for the gearox unless you go for a sti 7 6 speed box and diffs which will cost you around 3k plus fitting or a ppg gear set again around 4k

as rabbit says there not the best built but not as bad as as pulsur i got this one up to 420 bhp

beleive me it wasn't cheap to do then every week it was a case of what's gonna break next

also you will have to think about fuel costs that one was down to 7-8 on track and around 15-16 on the road a uk one is around the same as my 4mo is but they only 215 bhp and really arn't all that

i'm still a member of a lot of scoob sites and still go to alot of there meets and runs and my 4mo will keep up with all the uk cars and not alot slower than the imports

they may feel fast the first time you drive one because of the turbo kick especialy the early one's that run the td05 turbo as it comes in late and hard where as the newer and uk cars run the softer and quicker spooling td04 set up

but put your vr next to one on a private runway and you won't find much in it

[golfrabbit33 0]

the pulsar is a car you do not want to crash over 80mph, never known a car to offer such little all round protection, seen pics of pulsar crashes and cant believe how many pieces of the car just fold,smash or just left you thinking, so what happened to that bit, oh its 120ft away . lol

[b road blaster 0]

yes i know what you mean about the pulsur my miss wouldn't get in it after the first time lol lol

do'nt help when the the fisrt thing you check when buying one is the roof is still glued on and over 70 the door tops on mine used to start pulling out away from the car

but bloody hell it was a fun car untill somone stole it

[jims13 6]

yep most jap cars are not the best in terms of solid build quality.. ive had big power jap cars and been in many more including the uk's first 1000 bhp , 200 mph+ r34 liner. big power jap cars of any ilk cost big money, and are not any quicker or more reliable when push comes to shove

the vr may be old , but parts are cheap and it will take more abuse than its jap cousins. having owned both and having owned both types over long periods, im vw every time.

it also nonsense that you can pick up a decent jap car for less than you could turbo or supercharge a vr.

utter nonsense..

[AJmk2 2]

sorry mate your wrong' date=' i havent yet come across an evo or scooby thats quicker than a proper charged vr of either variant in the real world.

but each to their own

[/quote']

So your saying a 2wd ( 1wd in a lot of cases ) vr6 with lets face it not the best weight distribution especially when stripped are faster than evos with better weight distribution and 4wd with e diff magic?

I find that very hard to believe, especially when looking at the success of evos in time attack and the AAA saloon championship and sprints.

Personally when i hit boost if its low speed then i lose traction or if its wet i basically change lanes.

Im sure there are a lot of people who dont rag their evos everywhere but im pretty sure if the same driver was in both cars with equal power to weight you would be faster in the evo.

[b road blaster 0]

i think you can rule the time attack cars out as the cash spent on them is stupid a man i know was runing 600+ scoob in that and you really don't wanna know what it cost him

i'v also got another mate runing 658 on road fuel and 702 on race fuel think he needed a rather large remortgage for that lol lol

yes you can make a scoob or evo quicker than a vr but its not gonna be cheap just so you do know its not bul***** his car is the 4th one down on this page http://www.totalcarmagazines.co.uk/idol-impreza-4.htm

also to add he built and done all the engine work himself in his shed no paying sombody to do it and still mega bucks

so yes you can make one quicker and better than a vr but is the cost worth it ????

mike recons he has spent near 30k on his i wonder how much i could get out of my 4mo for that ???????

£ for £ i recon not alot in it

[jims13 6]

pound for pound , give me 10k and you could have a very nice 2wd or 4wd vr turbo.. there will always be someone quikcer than the next.

time attack cars imho , dont count as everyday cars . they dont even qualify as a track car, as most of the mods are over and above anything you may find on the average track day hero.

if you break traction all the time in second, then you need a larger housing .

i invite you to my next track day at snetterton on the 8th october.. ill happily take you round and show you what a competent car and driver an do..

the only place the evo/scooby has a edge in a t/light g prix for example is the launch, any gain it then has is then rapidly diminished. ive done alot of testing with my car, and i dont know of many evo's/scooby's/200 sx's/pulsar's/rx7's and skylines that will run a 12.5 q/m with full road trim, still do track days, and sprints + cart your family about and get 30 + mpg on a run

[jims13 6]

its horses for courses' , someone will always be quicker than the next.

BUT

for your car + 3k you will not find a similar specced jap rocket , when its all built and running .

imho 6-8 k is the bare minimum needed for a 400 bhp jap rocket .

you can do , that for less with any charger conversion .

but the choice is yours .

i dont tell porkies, ive done lots of track days etc, santa pod since i was 18 , im now 35 ( eek ). i know what works and what dont. as ive owned enough cars to last a lifetime and all have been modded.

[b road blaster 0]

to be honest with you i think your being very generous with 6-8k yes i could get 400 out of a evo or most jap cars for that but bet it wouldn't last more than a week lol lol for a full steel engine you gotta be looking at 5k worth of parts alone

i'v not had alot to do with the vr's so don't really know the costs on them

so what would it cost me to get my 4 mo to a true 400

[UnitedMotorsport 55]

I have and I am involved with ALOT of 4/5/600hp VR6 Turbo cars, both 2 and 4wd.

My mate has a 450hp EVO.

A FWD 450hp VR6T power MK2 Golf gets around tracks faster than the EVO does.

The guy that owns the EVO Knows this and love the fact, but he loves the Jap stuff to much to move.

The moral - Each to there own.

Currently I am involved in a high horse power EVO build, and the cost is rediculus.

VAG people like VAG cars

EVO people like EVO's, End off

[b road blaster 0]

well just to be akward i like both but for diffrent resons love my 4mo for the build quality but love the rawness of the early scoobs n evos

the only thing i will say that to me and me alone i personly wouldn't have ANY car over 250 bhp unless it was 4x4 only because i love the twisty bits rather than straight line speed and to me 4x4 is better for that

but i do think the newer 2wd set ups are getting very close to to the handerling of the 4x4

[adam.pah 0]

Just sold a '53 scooby STi PPP (300bhp standard) and bought a mk3 vr6. I loved the scooby but you just cant use them where i live! i'm sure if you lived in a rural area the scooby would be more fun but day to day the golf is a far more rounded car.

[AJmk2 2]

I was just saying when not taking money as the main priority.

As for a 450hp mk2 being faster than a 450hp evo there must be a large power to weight difference to explain the extra speed of the mk2.

The mk2 does not even have independant suspension. Definatly a worse weight distribution and the evo should easily be able to have a larger contact patch on the ground and maintain better geometry.

[H13VYY 0]

Traction will always be an issue with FWD running 300+ BHP. Evo's obviously have the upper hand on the looks side aswel. But the VR has the abit of luxury that the evo lacks, but if your not too fussed about the luxury then go for the evo.

I went for a Integra type-r from owning a VR6 for 3 years just for a change and i didn't regret it. I like to appreciate different marques and they all have different things to offer and have their distinctive pros and cons.

[Phat VR6 3]

yer although i love my VWs , mk2s 1 3 4 5 6 lol well most dubs im still a all round petrol head. m3 beemers old new skylines evo scoobys RX7s TVRs R8s, bikes ducatis R6s the new fireblade, crossers quads. i love em all.

i don't understand how adding 70bhp to evo 8 FQ320- with is already a turboed car can be so expensive? what also appeals to me is that its already done. buy it, open the door and i got a good handling 320 4 wheel drive car,

[xyber 1]

I'd say buy a car that's as powerful as you want straight out of the box, then save and mod that.

I spent a mental amount on my VR, which I'm glad I did because I learnt alot whilst building it, but it also highlighted the downside to doing it that way. It's definatly something everyone should do atleast once, but I don't think I'd buy a car, planning to up the power from the very start, again. I'll always mod any car I'll have, but it'll be quick to begin with and everything else is a bonus.

Plus once you've had a 6 pot, it's morally wrong to go back to 4, ever! Haha

I'm not far off as far is I can go on my S4 engine wise, for reasonable money already. So the car saving back account is up and running again for the next one in a few years

[The Monk 50]

Stick with the VR. Police may crash an Evo......